11:51 AM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#1
What problems are you referring to?
11:52 AM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#1
I didn't notice anything offensive.
11:58 AM
@Jzepp
You’ve heard the phrase, “show me your 5 friends and I’ll show you your future”. I could never quite make that work with my Christian beliefs.
11:59 AM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#1
@Jzepp Christians have no convictions that I can discern.
11:59 AM
@YawnGod
#2
Nothing like Claire and caffeine in the mornin' ☕
12:00 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#1
@YawnGod What convictions do you think Christians have? I thought the problem is that they have none that they can articulate other than the wish to remain Christian.
12:01 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#2
@YawnGod You would have thought that they believe in the Trinity, but they don't really believe in it other than to lower the status of Unitarians like Sam Tideman.
12:01 PM
@YawnGod
#3
@OfficialSecularKoranism What is more meaningful than wanting to be a thing you can't be? 🤔
12:02 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#2
@YawnGod That's ambition, isn't it?
12:02 PM
@ethan.caughey
Pretending to be a thing you can't be.
12:02 PM
@YawnGod
#3
@OfficialSecularKoranism Vices squeeze.
12:02 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#2
@ethan.caughey What do you think I want to be?
12:03 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#2
@YawnGod What?
12:03 PM
@YawnGod
#3
@OfficialSecularKoranism Poetry is a literary Rorschach test. Sometimes. 🦋
12:04 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#2
@YawnGod Why are you talking about poetry?
12:04 PM
@YawnGod
#3
@OfficialSecularKoranism Because non-fiction is boring.
12:05 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#2
@YawnGod You prefer to retreat into fantasy?
12:06 PM
@YawnGod
#3
@OfficialSecularKoranism Now you're going to make me talk about math.
12:06 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#2
So no one cares about doing the right thing. It's all about finding words to justify one's moral apathy.
12:07 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#2
Does Christianity actually cause intellectual apathy?
12:09 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#3
@YawnGod It's only us here and you want to talk about maths?
12:09 PM
@YawnGod
@OfficialSecularKoranism Math has that nice characteristic of both being non-fiction and fantasy at the same time.
12:10 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
#3
@YawnGod Do you fear to discuss morality?
12:10 PM
@YawnGod
@OfficialSecularKoranism I mean...idolatry bad? 🤔Did I win?
12:11 PM
@Jzepp
#1
When will all the rhetorical questions end? 😉
12:11 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@YawnGod Morality is more than idolatry. You're a nihilist, aren't you? Nihilists are proud not to have principles.
12:11 PM
@stefaniecristos8514
#2
I have friends who scream their moral outrage into the Facebook void. And other friends who quietly pray for peace and justice in the world. I wonder which is more effective.
12:11 PM
@YawnGod
@Jzepp 💯Based and funpilled.
12:12 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@stefaniecristos8514 Surely it is impossible to try neither?
12:12 PM
@stefaniecristos8514
#2
Touch grass. Help those in your sphere of influence.
12:12 PM
@stefaniecristos8514
#2
That is my position.
12:12 PM
@YawnGod
@OfficialSecularKoranism What do nihilists do?
12:13 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@stefaniecristos8514 How about helping them think straight and making men be men?
12:13 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@YawnGod Nihilists are proud they have no principles and is a product of atheism.
12:13 PM
@stefaniecristos8514
#2
That is your calling, Claire! ☺
12:13 PM
@YawnGod
@OfficialSecularKoranism That is "doing"? Hmm.
12:14 PM
@Jzepp
#1
Talk about something you can’t actually do. You can’t make people care.
12:14 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@stefaniecristos8514 So you think men are doing what they are supposed to do?
12:14 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp You don't think people can be shamed? Even dogs can be shamed.
12:15 PM
@Jzepp
#1
Stefanie, I heard a saying once about matching your circle of concern with your circle of influence. That resonates with me. We can do real good if we operate in that space.
12:15 PM
@Jzepp
#1
Shame doesn’t change people.
12:15 PM
@ethan.caughey
That's good Zepp!
12:15 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp Who do you influence?
12:16 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp Why do people get shamed by the media then?
12:16 PM
@Jzepp
#1
Those in my circle.
12:16 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp What do you influence them to do?
12:16 PM
@Jzepp
#1
Family, friends, coworkers, clients, etc.
12:16 PM
@stefaniecristos8514
#2
Zepp, that sounds wise to me.
12:17 PM
@Jzepp
#1
Not my words.
12:17 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp You make damn sure you never discuss politics, don't you? That is the mark of being middle class.
12:17 PM
@Jzepp
#1
I’m not very wise.
12:17 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp Do you think feminine risk-aversion is appropriate for men?
12:17 PM
@ethan.caughey
I love politics.
12:18 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@ethan.caughey You would rather die than talk to me on your own.
12:17 PM
@Jzepp
#1
I don’t care to be high class whatever that might mean.
12:18 PM
@ethan.caughey
I should be a consultant in feminine risk-aversion. I bet I could make a lot of money.
12:18 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp The middle classes like to pretend they are too high status to be affected by bad government policy.
12:18 PM
@ethan.caughey
I have told you numerous times that I want to talk to you. So that's just silly. And if memory serves, you stopped responding in Substack messages.
12:19 PM
@Jzepp
#1
I’m not shamed by you Claire. I would not likely enjoy talking with you, no.
12:19 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@ethan.caughey We can talk after this stream if you want.
12:19 PM
@Jzepp
#1
I’m actually quite involved in my local government.
12:19 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp No one enjoys being shamed.
12:19 PM
@teestrypzSOG
I watched your latest rant about TLC Claire
12:20 PM
@ethan.caughey
I have to go to work. I have very little spontaneous time.
12:20 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp Local politics is nothing to do with political principles.
12:20 PM
@teestrypzSOG
#1
It was hilarious
12:20 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@teestrypzSOG Thanks for drawing attention to it.
12:21 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Local political action always outweighs high and mighty principles.
12:21 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp So you have no political principles?
12:22 PM
@Jzepp
#2
I put them into action locally. That is how I influence.
12:23 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp So what are your political principles?
12:23 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Arguing with actions is much harder than principles, eh?
12:24 PM
@Jzepp
#2
I’m currently pushing a plan to unite everyone in our city with a plan to implement block parties officially promoted by our city.
12:24 PM
@Jzepp
#2
One street at a time.
12:24 PM
@YawnGod
Frank Herbert really nailed it.
12:25 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Is that a political principle? Unity? I do believe in that.
12:25 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp What are block parties?
12:25 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Maybe you should act more locally Claire? That might be more effective. What do you think?
12:26 PM
@YawnGod
The desert guys also have a local block party they do occasionally. To keep up morale. 🤔
12:26 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp So you don't think what I am saying needs to be said?
12:26 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Oh. Block parties are events where they block off your street and you meet all your neighbors for a day of fun. Let the kids play in the street safely, provide games, etc.
12:27 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
Bloc Party are an English rock band that was formed in London in 1999 by co-founders Kele Okereke (lead vocals, rhythm guitar, piano, sampler) and Russell Lissack (lead guitar).
12:28 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Say what you want, of course. I think actions change people more than words in general.
12:28 PM
@YawnGod
I like telling someone I hate them while I help them. It keeps it paradoxical.
12:28 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp So you don't have a view on schools and social problems and are careful not to express them if you have any.
12:29 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp Thinking and speaking are actions, aren't they?
12:29 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Words are cheap. Especially locally.
12:30 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Words are cheap. Especially locally.
12:30 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp So you don't think after all that's been said and done that America needs an OFFICIAL MORAL SYSTEM?
12:30 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp Platitudinous waffle is cheap. Are you saying I am guilty of platitudinous waffle?
12:31 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Claire, have you ever heard of Cathy Newman?
12:31 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp Anchorwoman who interviewed Jordan Peterson. What about her?
12:31 PM
@Jzepp
#2
I feel like I’ve fallen into a Cathy Newman interview…
12:32 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp I know you people have been trained not to talk about politics.
12:33 PM
@Jzepp
#2
You keep replying with,”so what you’re saying is?” And then change the topic…
12:33 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp You can always confirm or deny.
12:33 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Classic straw-man argument.
12:33 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
You are allowed the right to reply.
12:33 PM
@stefaniecristos8514
#3
Thanks for the explanation, Chris. I sometimes wonder what draws me to the corner. Then I remind myself I always learn something. 😊
12:33 PM
@YawnGod
pigsty
12:33 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Yup
12:33 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
How can I strawman a position of yours when you refuse to state your position?
12:34 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Exactly…
12:34 PM
@Jzepp
#2
You have figured me out…
12:35 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
Why is "So what you are saying is" so threatening? There an Islamophobic channel called New Cultural Forum whose motto is exactly that.
12:35 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
When you say "So what you're saying is", you can be either strawmanning or steelmanning someone's position.
12:36 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@stefaniecristos8514 What do you think of men too afraid to discuss politics?
12:36 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Have you ever steel manned anything?
12:37 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Try it sometime.
12:37 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp Sure. It is a very helpful way of showing the other person you are listening and sympathetic.
12:38 PM
@Jzepp
#2
Or to understand their position. Depends on your goal I guess.
12:38 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp You refuse to declare your political principles to avoid having to defend them.
12:38 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@OfficialSecularKoranism Shouldn't everyone have political principles to declare and defend?
12:39 PM
@stefaniecristos8514
#3
Claire, sometimes people just wanna talk about other things besides politics. I don’t see anything wrong with that.
12:40 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@stefaniecristos8514 It's actually pathological in the TLC and PVK encourages this.
12:40 PM
@Jzepp
#2
I talk politics. Not here.
12:40 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp You must protect yourself from cancellation in the Land of the Free!
12:41 PM
@Jzepp
#2
You’ll have to tell me how wrong I am in some other way I guess.
12:43 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp American husbands fearing to discuss politics is part of the problem. That is because their wife who can divorce them under the rules of no fault divorce is now policing the discourse.
12:43 PM
@MarkS.-ry7bm
listening while doing pullups
12:44 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
The accordion is a notoriously difficult instrument to play.
12:44 PM
@Jzepp
#2
You are super wrong about American women on that point Claire. Wow.
12:45 PM
@shoulderserf
If you don’t comment it in the chat, it didn’t happen
12:45 PM
@OfficialSecularKoranism
@Jzepp No wife has ever divorced her husband for his politics? Google is your friend.